Technical Question

[Sound Guy]

From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?

[Bob Howes]

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?
The Sound Guy

The L and R outputs of your mixer can be swapped without affecting the
polarity going to the speakers.

If you have EQ or speaker management boxes after the mixer out, that gives
you a few more places the cabling can be swapped over.

[Ron]

Post by Bob Howes

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?
The Sound Guy

The L and R outputs of your mixer can be swapped without affecting the
polarity going to the speakers.
If you have EQ or speaker management boxes after the mixer out, that
gives you a few more places the cabling can be swapped over.

Mark your output xlrs with blue and red tape, same with the cables from
your control rack to amps. Blue for Left, Red for right. Left = 1, right
+ 2, same as your hands

Ron

[Audio1]

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?

On more than one occasion I have walked in to a gig with sound provided
by big sound companies you probably have heard of and have found Main L
and Main R transposed like this, thus it is the first thing I check on
any sound system I have any involvement with. The tricky part is
figuring out where the transposition was made so you don't end up with
the EQ's, limiters, crossovers, etc transposed once you get L and R back
where they should be.

Careful labeling and set up will usually avoid these kinds of things.

[Richard Webb]

Post by Audio1
On more than one occasion I have walked in to a gig with sound
provided by big sound companies you probably have heard of and have
found Main L and Main R transposed like this, thus it is the first
thing I check on any sound system I have any involvement with. The
tricky part is figuring out where the transposition was made so you
don't end up with the EQ's, limiters, crossovers, etc transposed
once you get L and R back where they should be.

Which is one reason I like to have the processing gear
before the amps already wired in the rack. LEss chance for
this to happen.

Just means some careful troubleshooting, and clearly marking the connections that any stage crew might have to patch,
such as between your snake's stage box and the
amp/processing rack, etc.

Post by Audio1
Careful labeling and set up will usually avoid these kinds of things.

INdeed it will, and careful setup starts with careful
labeling, especially if you have helpers with setup.

Regards,
Richard
... Remote audio in the southland: See www.gatasound.com
--
| Remove .my.foot for email
| via Waldo's Place USA Fidonet<->Internet Gateway Site
| Standard disclaimer: The views of this user are strictly his own.

[Krooburg Science]

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped.  I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon.  We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards.  If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa.  I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.  We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind.  Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."

- K

[Steve M]

Post by Krooburg Science

...everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards.

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band

Damn right. Note the only bit I quoted from "Sound Guy".
Since when does anything come out of a "fader"? He doesn't even use
standard,
simple terminology to describe the scenario.


I'll bet he's one hell of a "sound guy" .

--
Steve McQ

[Sound Guy]

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped.  I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon.  We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards.  If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa.  I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.  We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind.  Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

I didn't come here for a smart assed answer. I asked an honest question
of the group and all I wanted was some helpful advice. Thank you to
those who managed to give me a civil reply. I've been in this business
for four years now, and I assumed I'd find a higher calibur of
professionalism than that from others in the business. I suppose you and
Steve are to good to be bothered trying to share a little helpful advice
with your competition. To Richard, Bob, Ron, and Audio1, I thank you for
your suggestions and comments. The rest of you can kiss my ass.

[Joe Kotroczo]

Post by Sound Guy

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

I didn't come here for a smart assed answer. I asked an honest question
of the group and all I wanted was some helpful advice. Thank you to
those who managed to give me a civil reply. I've been in this business
for four years now, and I assumed I'd find a higher calibur of
professionalism than that from others in the business. I suppose you and
Steve are to good to be bothered trying to share a little helpful advice
with your competition. To Richard, Bob, Ron, and Audio1, I thank you for
your suggestions and comments. The rest of you can kiss my ass.

Sorry, but what is smartarsed about his answer? From your writing that
your attempt to diagnose a simple L/R swap was to "check polarity of
your speakers" one can only conclude that you are absolutely clueless
about audio systems.

Or you are simply a troll.

[Richard Webb]

Thank you to those who managed to give me a civil reply. I've been
in this business for four years now, and I assumed I'd find a
higher calibur of professionalism than that from others in the
business. I suppose you and Steve are to good to be bothered
trying to share a little helpful advice with your competition. To
Richard, Bob, Ron, and Audio1, I thank you for your suggestions and
comments. The rest of you can kiss my ass.

Glad I could help. AS I told him, I was trying to be nice.
IT's obvious you're a newbie and yes, four years is a
relative newbie compared to many of us inhabiting this
group. Checking your speaker polarity was the wrong place
to check, and that points out that though you've learned
some of the basic mechanics of connecting what your ears
tell you to what's happening with the gear a lot of the
finer technical points are probably still new to you.
Especially difficult troubleshooting when you've got all
sorts of "help" setting up, etc.

LEt me give you a pointer, check out the newsgroup
rec.audio.pro as well, and look for pointers to the
rec.audio.pro frequently asked questions file, which will
help you get up to speed a bit technically. The Yamaha
sound reinforcement handbook is another resource for you.

This is a tough newsgroup for newbies, as oftentimes it's
hard to tell the newbies from the trolls, and again,
remember that newbie isn't an insult, and four years in the
business is relatively young compared to a lot of us
grizzled old farts. There will be certain personalities
that are abrasive and rude to anybody, and some of them can
even dispense some good technical info once you cut through
the bullshit. OThers just have a short fuse and low
tolerance for trolls, and you got caught. YOur post shouted out to me that you're relatively new to the business, and
got caught in one that catches us all. Troubleshooting
itself is an art, you get better at it after awhile. We've
all chased what wasn't the problem when troubleshooting,
especially when we were still trying to integrate it all and figure out wtf.


Regards,
Richard
--
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| via Waldo's Place USA Fidonet<->Internet Gateway Site
| Standard disclaimer: The views of this user are strictly his own.

[Krooburg Science]

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped.  I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon.  We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards.  If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa.  I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.  We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind.  Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

I didn't come here for a smart assed answer.  I asked an honest question
of the group and all I wanted was some helpful advice.  Thank you to
those who managed to give me a civil reply.  I've been in this business
for four years now, and I assumed I'd find a higher calibur of
professionalism than that from others in the business.  I suppose you and
Steve are to good to be bothered trying to share a little helpful advice
with your competition.  To Richard, Bob, Ron, and Audio1, I thank you for
your suggestions and comments.  The rest of you can kiss my ass.
--
The Sound Guy

Look DUDE. If you can't figure out how to fix a fucking left/right
swap after 4 YEARS, you don't have what it takes to be a sound
"engineer". It's a Wiring 101, first day of class. It's the next
chapter after the 1st one: "How to turn the oh - en /oh-eff-eff
switch to oh-en." Time to apply at McDonalds. I hear they're hiring
these days. Be careful to not half the headset switch set to "talk"
when you're trying to listen to the customers in the drive-thru. You
seem to have issues with that soft of thing.

xo
- K

[NOZ]

On Tue, 8 Nov 2011 09:29:19 -0800 (PST), Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped.  I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon.  We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards.  If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa.  I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.  We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind.  Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

I didn't come here for a smart assed answer.  I asked an honest question
of the group and all I wanted was some helpful advice.  Thank you to
those who managed to give me a civil reply.  I've been in this business
for four years now, and I assumed I'd find a higher calibur of
professionalism than that from others in the business.  I suppose you and
Steve are to good to be bothered trying to share a little helpful advice
with your competition.  To Richard, Bob, Ron, and Audio1, I thank you for
your suggestions and comments.  The rest of you can kiss my ass.
--
The Sound Guy

Look DUDE. If you can't figure out how to fix a fucking left/right
swap after 4 YEARS, you don't have what it takes to be a sound
"engineer". It's a Wiring 101, first day of class. It's the next
chapter after the 1st one: "How to turn the oh - en /oh-eff-eff
switch to oh-en." Time to apply at McDonalds. I hear they're hiring
these days. Be careful to not half the headset switch set to "talk"
when you're trying to listen to the customers in the drive-thru. You
seem to have issues with that soft of thing.
xo
- K

And you seem to have anger issues, Not a good thing. Just saying.

[PeterD]

Post by NOZ
On Tue, 8 Nov 2011 09:29:19 -0800 (PST), Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science
Look DUDE. If you can't figure out how to fix a fucking left/right
swap after 4 YEARS, you don't have what it takes to be a sound
"engineer". It's a Wiring 101, first day of class. It's the next
chapter after the 1st one: "How to turn the oh - en /oh-eff-eff
switch to oh-en." Time to apply at McDonalds. I hear they're hiring
these days. Be careful to not half the headset switch set to "talk"
when you're trying to listen to the customers in the drive-thru. You
seem to have issues with that soft of thing.
xo
- K

And you seem to have anger issues, Not a good thing. Just saying.

No, he's right. The guy came and said he was a professional in the
field. That says he has considerable knowledge, and then asks a question
that is (as Krooburg say) is basic 101 stuff.

I'm more inclined to think the OP was a troll, looking for his five
seconds of fame. And, it appears he got it. His replies were classic,
too, well done in that aspect.

[geoff]

PeterD wrote:

thing. Just saying.

Post by PeterD
No, he's right. The guy came and said he was a professional in the
field. That says he has considerable knowledge, and then asks a
question that is (as Krooburg say) is basic 101 stuff.

.. and getting it totally WRONG.

BTW, OP, amateurs, let al.one professionals, know that speaker 'polarity'
has nothing to do with Left/Right Channel Assignment.

I keep L and R easily identified with different coloured cables.

geoff

[Steve M]

Post by PeterD
I'm more inclined to think the OP was a troll,

I agree that after re-reading the intial post and his followups, it seemed
to reek of troll bait.
But, as we all know, there are actually people out there who don't have a
clue, and can't
even express questions or problems in standard, accepted terminology.


Arnii, Dobony, and a few others come to mind.

--
Steve McQ

[Arny Krueger]

Post by Sound Guy
I didn't come here for a smart assed answer.

Wrong place. Try the PSW live sound forums - there are moderators there that
keep the riff-raff under control.

Post by Sound Guy
I asked an honest question
of the group and all I wanted was some helpful advice. Thank you to
those who managed to give me a civil reply. I've been in this business
for four years now, and I assumed I'd find a higher calibur of
professionalism than that from others in the business.

AAPLS is full of its own worst enemies.

Some of them would make good pack mule replacements for the larger, more
durable pieces during a load in or load out, but no way should they be
allowed to come near delicate or actual functioning live sound equipment
during a show. As you later point out there are a few worthwhile voices
here, but there are so many of the others.

[Denny Strauser]

Post by Arny Krueger
AAPLS is full of its own worst enemies.
Some of them would make good pack mule replacements for the larger, more
durable pieces during a load in or load out, but no way should they be
allowed to come near delicate or actual functioning live sound equipment
during a show. As you later point out there are a few worthwhile voices
here, but there are so many of the others.

I am, by no means endorsing or condemning anyone in this newsgroup. But
there will, from time to time, be some giving some excellent advice.
Some from a theoretical/technical/repair viewpoint ... some from a
real-life situation .... the show must go on kind of situation.

I'm putting on my flame-proof-suit for this .... but some technicians
who say some things are impossible are half-clueless. Some sound
engineers are half-clueless. Some of us half-wits have more of a clue
than those self-described EXPERTS.

And, I might say, those who are the most abrasive & rude in their
responses are the ones with half a clue.

- Denny

[Phil Allison]

"Denny Strauser"

Post by Denny Strauser
And, I might say, those who are the most abrasive & rude in their
responses are the ones with half a clue.

** Am I being condemned here with faint praise ?






... Phil

[PeterD]

Post by Phil Allison
"Denny Strauser"

And, I might say, those who are the most abrasive& rude in their
responses are the ones with half a clue.

** Am I being condemned here with faint praise ?

Naw, you're being praised with a faint ting of condemnation!

[Denny Strauser]

Post by Phil Allison
"Denny Strauser"

And, I might say, those who are the most abrasive& rude in their
responses are the ones with half a clue.

** Am I being condemned here with faint praise ?
... Phil

LOL ... the faintest .... LOL ... at least, you have the right half of a
clue.

- Denny

[Denny Strauser]

Post by Denny Strauser

Post by Phil Allison
"Denny Strauser"

And, I might say, those who are the most abrasive& rude in their
responses are the ones with half a clue.

** Am I being condemned here with faint praise ?
... Phil

LOL ... the faintest .... LOL ... at least, you have the right half of a
clue.

And, Phil, what made you think you were one of those I had in mind when
I made that post?

Chuckle, chuckle ...

[Audio1]

On 11/13/2011 4:52 AM, Denny Strauser wrote:
...

Post by Denny Strauser
And, I might say, those who are the most abrasive & rude in their
responses are the ones with half a clue.
- Denny

*Half* a clue is right but what's needed is someone with a full clue.

Those with half a clue get all defensive and want to play 'my dick is
bigger than yours' so you don't notice they're half-assed as well as
half-clued.

Those with a full clue are polite, professional and avoid cryptic
descriptions and comments. They're more open and complete with the
information they share and aren't interested in engaging in insults and
ad hominem attacks with those who are truly interested in professional
audio regardless of the level of experience.

[Phil's Toaster Repair]

Post by Audio1
Those with a full clue are polite, professional and avoid cryptic
descriptions and comments.

They are called waiters. Go work in a restaurant if you can't handle
life.Tips are good I hear.

Your inability to even fathom the problem, much less a solution, puts
you in a position to criticize no one.

I'm done junior. Now go wash behind your ears, okay?

[Audio1]

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair

Post by Audio1
Those with a full clue are polite, professional and avoid cryptic
descriptions and comments.

They are called waiters.

Don Pearson was a waiter? Wow, I never knew, I just thought he was the
system engineer. He *did* point out the catering cooler at FOH and told
me to 'help yourself,' but he didn't actually take my order and bring it
to me. That may be why I didn't pick up on his waiter status. Buford
Jones wasn't dressed like a waiter but he was very polite and
professional. You should attend one of his seminars and see what that's
like, what life is like where people know what they're doing instead of
faking something they read in a magazine.

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair
Go work in a restaurant if you can't handle
life.Tips are good I hear.

I don't need to work in food service, I do quite well where I'm at,
including having the privilege of *firing* jerks like you when they
won't stop causing problems because their ego is bigger than their skill
set. I suspect you've more than once found a bus ticket in your per diem
envelope, that is, if you've ever gotten per diem. I have my doubts.

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair
Your inability to even fathom the problem, much less a solution, puts
you in a position to criticize no one.

You're not someone with half a clue, you're someone with no clue at all
and no possible sliver of hope that you'll ever get one. Sad, really,
someone at your age with a technical and social skill set only suitable
for 1970.

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair
I'm done junior.

Be sure you wipe well, hemorrhoids at your age can be fatal.

[Phil Allison]

"Audio1 = TROLLING WANKER "

Post by Audio1

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair

Post by Audio1
Those with a full clue are polite, professional and avoid cryptic
descriptions and comments.

They are called waiters.

Don Pearson was a waiter?

** Jesus Christ Almighty !!!!!

Piss off - you know nothing bloody IDIOT !!

Post by Audio1
I don't need to work in food service,

** Never fear - you soon will need to.

But have no hope of ever qualifying

Post by Audio1
Be sure you wipe well, hemorrhoids at your age can be fatal.

** Really ??

Then how come a giant one like YOU is still alive ?

FOAD you stinking waste of space.



... Phil

[LLamey]

Post by Phil Allison
"Audio1 = TROLLING WANKER "

Post by Audio1

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair

Post by Audio1
Those with a full clue are polite, professional and avoid cryptic
descriptions and comments.

They are called waiters.

Don Pearson was a waiter?

** Jesus Christ Almighty !!!!!
Piss off - you know nothing bloody IDIOT !!

Post by Audio1
I don't need to work in food service,

** Never fear - you soon will need to.
But have no hope of ever qualifying

Post by Audio1
Be sure you wipe well, hemorrhoids at your age can be fatal.

** Really ??
Then how come a giant one like YOU is still alive ?
FOAD you stinking waste of space.
... Phil

He's got you all in tears and foaming like a rabid dog? LOL

[Audio1]

Hi Phil,
We're all well aware that you're generally the most egregious of those
causing the problems so you don't have to exemplify your status for us,
but thank you anyway!

P.S. - Go find out who Don Pearson was, you're obviously ignorant in
that regard, sweetie!

"Audio1 = TROLLING WANKER"

Post by Audio1

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair

Post by Audio1
Those with a full clue are polite, professional and avoid cryptic
descriptions and comments.

They are called waiters.

Don Pearson was a waiter?

** Jesus Christ Almighty !!!!!
Piss off - you know nothing bloody IDIOT !!

Post by Audio1
I don't need to work in food service,

** Never fear - you soon will need to.
But have no hope of ever qualifying

Post by Audio1
Be sure you wipe well, hemorrhoids at your age can be fatal.

** Really ??
Then how come a giant one like YOU is still alive ?
FOAD you stinking waste of space.
... Phil

[Denny Strauser]

<much snipped>
Hi Phil,
... Don Pearson ...

Post by Phil Allison
... Phil

How many on this NG do not know who "DR" Don Pearson is?

-Denny

[Phil Allison]

"Audio1 = TROLLING WANKER "

Post by Audio1

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair

Post by Audio1
Those with a full clue are polite, professional and avoid cryptic
descriptions and comments.

They are called waiters.

Don Pearson was a waiter?

** Jesus Christ Almighty !!!!!

Piss off - you know nothing bloody IDIOT !!

Post by Audio1
I don't need to work in food service,

** Never fear - you soon will need to.

But have no hope of ever qualifying

Post by Audio1
Be sure you wipe well, hemorrhoids at your age can be fatal.

** Really ??

Then how come a giant one like YOU is still alive ?

FOAD you stinking waste of space.



... Phil

[PeterD]

Post by Krooburg Science

From one professional to (I hope) another...
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

But, but he's a professional!

[Richard Webb]

Post by Krooburg Science
If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."

I was thinking much the same but was trying to be nice to
the guy <g>. <rotflmao!!!>

Regards,
Richard
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[NOS]

On Mon, 7 Nov 2011 09:32:50 -0800 (PST), Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped.  I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon.  We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards.  If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa.  I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.  We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind.  Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

Why do you have to be so crude to someone just trying to make a
living?

[Krooburg Science]

Post by NOS
On Mon, 7 Nov 2011 09:32:50 -0800 (PST), Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped.  I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon.  We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards.  If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa.  I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.  We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind.  Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

Why do you have to be so crude to someone just trying to make a
living?

Crude? Moi? That wasn't crude in the least. Read some of Allison's
posts. Here's crude: "Hey 'Sound Guy,' you're obviously a clueless
twat and have no FUCKING business anywhere near sound systems. Why
don't you un-fuck yourself and read book on BASIC LOGIC which is all
wring and signal flow is? Claiming you've been in the biz for 4 YEARS
and not knowing how to troubleshoot a SIMPLE left/right signal swap
means you're either dyslexic or retarded. In any case, save everyone
the trouble now dealing with your utter incompetence and find a career
in fast food services or possibly the Tea Party Patriots.

with a big wet smooch,
- K

P.S. NOS, FOAD.

[Joe Kotroczo]

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by NOS
On Mon, 7 Nov 2011 09:32:50 -0800 (PST), Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

Why do you have to be so crude to someone just trying to make a
living?

Crude? Moi? That wasn't crude in the least. Read some of Allison's
posts. Here's crude: "Hey 'Sound Guy,' you're obviously a clueless
twat and have no FUCKING business anywhere near sound systems. Why
don't you un-fuck yourself and read book on BASIC LOGIC which is all
wring and signal flow is? Claiming you've been in the biz for 4 YEARS
and not knowing how to troubleshoot a SIMPLE left/right signal swap
means you're either dyslexic or retarded. In any case, save everyone
the trouble now dealing with your utter incompetence and find a career
in fast food services or possibly the Tea Party Patriots.
with a big wet smooch,
- K
P.S. NOS, FOAD.

Yup, that's about the level of crudeness one can expect when working in
the music industry.

[Steve Hawkins]

Post by Joe Kotroczo

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by NOS
On Mon, 7 Nov 2011 09:32:50 -0800 (PST), Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming
band that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at
a local community college recently, and everything coming out of
my fader was ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel,
the left channel would get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the
polarity of my speakers, and it was correct. We were able to get
through the show ok, but it was a little tricky because there's
one part where I have to crank the right side up higher, and I had
to remember that everything was backwards. This has never happened
before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody out there have
any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or
tech'ing PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big
hit real soon."
- K

Why do you have to be so crude to someone just trying to make a
living?

Crude? Moi? That wasn't crude in the least. Read some of Allison's
posts. Here's crude: "Hey 'Sound Guy,' you're obviously a clueless
twat and have no FUCKING business anywhere near sound systems. Why
don't you un-fuck yourself and read book on BASIC LOGIC which is all
wring and signal flow is? Claiming you've been in the biz for 4 YEARS
and not knowing how to troubleshoot a SIMPLE left/right signal swap
means you're either dyslexic or retarded. In any case, save everyone
the trouble now dealing with your utter incompetence and find a
career in fast food services or possibly the Tea Party Patriots.
with a big wet smooch,
- K
P.S. NOS, FOAD.

Yup, that's about the level of crudeness one can expect when working
in the music industry.

Interesting......based on this thread, there seems to be an overabundance
of assholes.

[PeterD]

Post by Steve Hawkins
Interesting......based on this thread, there seems to be an overabundance
of assholes.

Of course, because we all have at least one!

[NOZ]

On Tue, 8 Nov 2011 09:38:20 -0800 (PST), Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by NOS
On Mon, 7 Nov 2011 09:32:50 -0800 (PST), Krooburg Science

Post by Krooburg Science

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped.  I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon.  We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards.  If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa.  I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.  We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind.  Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

If you don't know how to correct a simple L/R swap and find the
phenomenon to be "mind blowing," you shouldn't be mixing or tech'ing
PA for *any* band let alone one that's "going to be a big hit real
soon."
- K

Why do you have to be so crude to someone just trying to make a
living?

Crude? Moi? That wasn't crude in the least. Read some of Allison's
posts. Here's crude: "Hey 'Sound Guy,' you're obviously a clueless
twat and have no FUCKING business anywhere near sound systems. Why
don't you un-fuck yourself and read book on BASIC LOGIC which is all
wring and signal flow is? Claiming you've been in the biz for 4 YEARS
and not knowing how to troubleshoot a SIMPLE left/right signal swap
means you're either dyslexic or retarded. In any case, save everyone
the trouble now dealing with your utter incompetence and find a career
in fast food services or possibly the Tea Party Patriots.
with a big wet smooch,
- K
P.S. NOS, FOAD.

So childish.

[geoff]

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel
would get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my
speakers, and it was correct. We were able to get through the show
ok, but it was a little tricky because there's one part where I have
to crank the right side up higher, and I had to remember that
everything was backwards. This has never happened before, and it's
really blowing my mind. Anybody out there have any ideas?

Not a brain-fart and confused with 'stage-left' versus 'audience-left', etc
?!!

geoff

[Phil Allison]

"Sound Guy"

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.

** Swap the knobs on each fader - that will fix it.


We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a

Post by Sound Guy
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?

** Swap the knob behind the mixer too.


.... Phil

[Sound Guy]

Post by Steve M
"Sound Guy"

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct.

** Swap the knobs on each fader - that will fix it.

Yeah, right. And if I put the "W" button on my keyboard upside down, it
types an "M". Asshole.

Post by Steve M
We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a

Post by Sound Guy
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?

** Swap the knob behind the mixer too.
.... Phil

[B***@somewhere.com]

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?

You didn't mention what equipment you have, it's impossible to trouble-shoot the
unknown...

Are you saying that the entire band was reversed? Just what sound are you
controlling? Were the drums reversed?

Do you have a single sound system or do the band members have their own amps?
Electronic or mic'd acoustic drums? How many speakers do you have, subs and top
boxes?

Somewhere you have your cables for right and left reversed. Do you plug this
stuff together yourself? Do you have the cables tagged? Do you have a snake? Are
all the in and out jacks labeled?

I can't picture what you have at all... it weighs heavy on my mind... fading the
whole band up and down left and right ass-backwards blows my mind too!

Quel vie!

[Sean Conolly]

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?

Shit happens sometimes, that's why it's always good to do a stupid double
check of everything as you are setting up. Color coding the cables helps a
lot, and so does following a very rigid sequence of setting up - more so if
you have people helping you.

Sean

[Joe Kotroczo]

Post by Sean Conolly

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?

Shit happens sometimes, that's why it's always good to do a stupid double
check of everything as you are setting up. Color coding the cables helps a
lot, and so does following a very rigid sequence of setting up - more so if
you have people helping you.

Checking whether left is left and right is right is a very basic step in
setting up a sound system. It's the first thing you do once you've stuck
a CD in the CD player. It's also why most of us will connect the CD
player to 2 mono channels panned hard left and hard right.

[Denny Strauser]

Post by Joe Kotroczo
Checking whether left is left and right is right is a very basic step in
setting up a sound system. It's the first thing you do once you've stuck
a CD in the CD player. It's also why most of us will connect the CD
player to 2 mono channels panned hard left and hard right.

Agreed! I am so anal about "little" details like left & right ... and
"phase/polarity" ...
Plugging a CD (iPod, these days) into two mono channels & panning them
will tell much. I cannot tell you how many times a guest engineer has
complained that left & right do not sound the same because his stereo
playback CD/iPod doesn't sound the same left & right.
Basic stuff for some of us ...
Oh .... don't get me started in this direction ...

- Denny

[Gareth Magennis]

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

Push up left fader. If you have a multiway crossover, unmute left high.
Turn up left high amp(s). You should get left high.
Unmute left mid, turn up left mid amp(S). Unmute left low, turn up low
amps. Same for sub if you have any.

Pull down left fader, turn up right fader. Repeat process on right side.

Now you are sure that everything is in the right place and you haven't blown
a shed load of tweeters/mids by running bass through them.



If instead your rig is one desk, one Peavey amp and 2 speakers, then you
deserve all the flack you've been getting here.



Gareth.



Gareth.

[Audio1]

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

Push up left fader. If you have a multiway crossover, unmute left high.
Turn up left high amp(s). You should get left high.
Unmute left mid, turn up left mid amp(S). Unmute left low, turn up low
amps. Same for sub if you have any.

It's safer to start with the subs and lows in case somehow your lows or
mids got patched to the highs. That way you get hissy woofers which are
much more preferable to and easier to fix than blown tweeters.

Pull down left fader, turn up right fader. Repeat process on right side.
Now you are sure that everything is in the right place and you haven't
blown a shed load of tweeters/mids by running bass through them.

Unless, of course, it was mis-patched as I mentioned and you tried the
highs first.

If instead your rig is one desk, one Peavey amp and 2 speakers, then you
deserve all the flack you've been getting here.

He doesn't deserve any flack from anybody, he's relatively new at it,
likely didn't have any mentors other than some crappy books and he asked
a question. If you don't have a good, useful answer for him maybe you
should just shut the fuck up and go away.

[Gareth Magennis]

Post by Audio1

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

Push up left fader. If you have a multiway crossover, unmute left high.
Turn up left high amp(s). You should get left high.
Unmute left mid, turn up left mid amp(S). Unmute left low, turn up low
amps. Same for sub if you have any.

It's safer to start with the subs and lows in case somehow your lows or
mids got patched to the highs. That way you get hissy woofers which are
much more preferable to and easier to fix than blown tweeters.

Pull down left fader, turn up right fader. Repeat process on right side.
Now you are sure that everything is in the right place and you haven't
blown a shed load of tweeters/mids by running bass through them.

Unless, of course, it was mis-patched as I mentioned and you tried the
highs first.

If instead your rig is one desk, one Peavey amp and 2 speakers, then you
deserve all the flack you've been getting here.

He doesn't deserve any flack from anybody, he's relatively new at it,
likely didn't have any mentors other than some crappy books and he asked a
question. If you don't have a good, useful answer for him maybe you should
just shut the fuck up and go away.

I disagree.
If you first unmute the crossover high, the only amplified signal you can
output is a high.
You can put that through any speaker without damage, and unless it is
actually going through tweeters it is going to sound very wrong.

Your version risks unmuting the Sub signal and running it through tweeters.



Gareth.

[Gareth Magennis]

Well, if you want to be 100% safe, you should really unmute in order:

Left High, Right High, Left Mid, Right Mid etc.





Gareth.

[Audio1]

On 11/8/2011 2:39 PM, Gareth Magennis wrote:
...

Post by Gareth Magennis
You can put that through any speaker without damage, and unless it is
actually going through tweeters it is going to sound very wrong.

You're correct, I mis-read your post on a screen too small to read in a
bouncy car.

[Phil's Toaster Repair]

Post by Audio1

Post by Sound Guy
From one professional to (I hope) another, I have a technical problem
that has me stumped. I provide the sound for an up and coming band
that's going to hit it big real soon. We were doing a gig at a local
community college recently, and everything coming out of my fader was
ass-backwards. If I cranked up the right channel, the left channel would
get higher, and vice-versa. I checked the polarity of my speakers, and
it was correct. We were able to get through the show ok, but it was a
little tricky because there's one part where I have to crank the right
side up higher, and I had to remember that everything was backwards.
This has never happened before, and it's really blowing my mind. Anybody
out there have any ideas?
--
The Sound Guy

Push up left fader. If you have a multiway crossover, unmute left high.
Turn up left high amp(s). You should get left high.
Unmute left mid, turn up left mid amp(S). Unmute left low, turn up low
amps. Same for sub if you have any.

It's safer to start with the subs and lows in case somehow your lows or
mids got patched to the highs. That way you get hissy woofers which are
much more preferable to and easier to fix than blown tweeters.

Pull down left fader, turn up right fader. Repeat process on right side.
Now you are sure that everything is in the right place and you haven't
blown a shed load of tweeters/mids by running bass through them.

Unless, of course, it was mis-patched as I mentioned and you tried the
highs first.

If instead your rig is one desk, one Peavey amp and 2 speakers, then you
deserve all the flack you've been getting here.

He doesn't deserve any flack from anybody, he's relatively new at it,
likely didn't have any mentors other than some crappy books and he asked
a question. If you don't have a good, useful answer for him maybe you
should just shut the fuck up and go away.

He REALLY should know how to patch after 4 years.

And if he can't handle crap he's gonna be in trouble if that band
makes it. No room for wannabees at the top.

[Audio1]

Post by Phil's Toaster Repair
...
And if he can't handle crap he's gonna be in trouble if that band
makes it. No room for wannabees at the top.

You obviously haven't spent much time there.